hello. Just confused over a simple matter.

It seems that since SMC started, there had been a couple of cases when magicians are unhappy about how another magician views his own philosophy.

So i'd like to clarify what most of you would call acceptable.

Alright, the latest example. The guy on TV bending forks.
He did the performance and told others he was using his psychic power to make it bend etc...

And so some smart guy would pop up and say it's not acceptable that such a comment takes place. It should be an issue of entertainment than "promoting" his own psychic ability.

Well.. i've been to shops and asked magicians what they would say. some said they it's a mentalist performance. That implies that psychic is the regular word used.. If that's right. why are there smart poppers who insist such phrases cant be used?

If you think it is wrong, what then should be the "right" word to use?

please share so all of us can understand your philosophy.

thanks,
Chris

i have a name, i do not need new ones. so feel free to use mine, it will make this entire thing clearer. :)

to people who are really so bothered about what ppl say abt them, i say u are insecure about what is the truth. that is an even more compelling reason for u to consider what that guy is saying. everyone voices their opinions and u have no right to be angry over any.

u bet i will!

entertainment with a psychic theme is one thing, saying u are a psychic is another. if u say ur a psychic, u are just a fraud, a fake, a conman!

"what about magic?" u may protest. well, magic now has largely lost that "occult" feeling to it and practically noone believes in real magic anymore. magic is now associated with entertainment (like psychic entertainment shud) and the arts. unless u claim that magic is real, its perfectly fine to say u are a "magician" as u actually mean u are a "magical artist" or "magical entertainment".


btw, i believe this topic has been started before by blackwing, and a discussion where comments and stands from both sides of the debate were made absolutely clear and were very detailed. check there for more info (think its under general magic) and please refrain from starting threads on topics discussed before.

and since we are now on this accusation that i force my opinions upon others, this accusation not being new, i'll entertain it.

i usually do, yes, thats true. and its because i wanted to help, by advocating what i believe is right. but then again, we all do! we voice our opinions to condemn, convince and convert. I being an extremist, took it to the limits. but now, i dont really care what others do in their performance. if they insist on doing a pass to control a card secretly while ppl are looking, i'll let them be. their lifes/deaths are not my concern anymore. i have never forcefully pushed for a style of performance, each one has his own unique style. i may advocate certain theories, but in the end, i do recognise that each person has a right to do what he wants, and ppl who understand beyond my argument knows this as well.

but when it touches on ethics, morals, things that hurt, or have the potential to hurt others, i will step in and have my say, to which i am fully entitled to. this is no longer style, style is in the theme, atmosphere and the character. u can present something as psychic entertainment as an entertainer, but once u claim to be psychic, i will expose and condemn u as houdini did in his time.

I agree with this point. Am I a smart guy? :D

Mentalist performance implies psychic? I don't think so. It depends on individual point of view. There'e no right or wrong here.


There's always people who agree and disagree with what others say. You can't force one to agree with your point.

Conclusion = agree to disagree.

yes u are. :)

and i agree with what u say. short and concise. thanks!

okie.. Good and interesting answers. Well it seems the conclusion can be somewhat close to, just do what you want.. But dont be absurb and dont push your "rank" from magician to something else.

If others ask if it's psychic, it's best to say,"no, it's using your mind to bend the spoon." or "no, its mentalist"

:)

Heartsofclubs. Do you believe in freedom of speech?

Yes.. i do.. and infact.. what ever answers ppl give i dont find anything wrong with it... Even if it's stupidly rediculous.. like eg: Oh i can bend spoons cos i meditated for 41 days without sleeping..

After all.. it's the way that person wants to say it..

It's the issue of that TV guy saying he is psychic and almost quite a few resented his answer.. (which till now i honsetly think.. Hey it's his own way ok? so just leave it to him.. he is not imposing any crap on you..) Based on the "resentment" i decided to know what are the expectations of some of them.

yeah that's why this thread was started.. I just think that if you dont let him say what he wants.. it's being quite communist and Boring..

The thing is that, hes doing mentalism. And mentalism isnt some sort of stupid tricks. And mentalism lies in the presentation, and i cant rem what he said exactly, but if you present mentalism like little tricks, the effect on the audience is down.

mayb he juz wanna keep himself mysterious.. lolx.

Yeah i agree with you.. There's nothing wrong with what he said. :P

Yea! If you think about it, if someone does a 'predict a selected card' by means of guessing or potraying his method as pure luck, as compared to someone who pretends to concentrate n look deep into the person's eyes..and slowly but surely, tell the colour..then the suit..then the number..which one is more beautiful. When it comes to mentalism, the presentation will really differ from normal card tricks..as to telling people that you're a psychic..well as long as you're not making people buy your product (like deity water or crystal ball or wadeva) and you're not conning people's money, there really isn't anything wrong with it, i think. :)

I believe that there is really nothing wrong if you claim you are a psychic, provided that you are responsible of what you claim and other issues that arise as a result.

Anyway, u are digging up some old topics.