Hi guys/gals,

I've been asked to perform a trick for the youth service in my church this Sunday.

The theme is on worship and how we are to "always to be amazed" by God.

I need a simple trick for a group of around 60-70 teens. Just going to perform one trick. Preacher will ask me to the front before his conclusion.

I'm out of ideas. Can someone help with some useful tricks and illustrations? It's a last minute request. Should be related to the theme.

Quite desperate now. Please help. LOL.

:wacko:

First off, I want to say that I envy you.

I've always wanted to do a gospel magic themed performance, but I never had the chance.

Anyway, if you are comfortable with cards, then you could do 'revelation in spades' (Greg Wilson) or some other similar one by one 13 card revelation to this patter:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuwq0L1HDsQ&feature=related

I don't know how close it would be to your theme, but its still an idea.

You could tear and restore a King of Spades as an illustration of Jesus's death and resurrection. Corny, but safe.

--

As a little side note, I feel gospel magic is very very hard to do because the medium tends to overpower the message most of the time. Either you have lousy magic and more contextual meaning (really corny) or your magic is powerful but the message is lost. Very hard to balance.

Yea. that's the problem. The balance is hard to find when the message is supposed to take precedence over the trick. And I'm not the speaker in this case even. The preacher just called to say that he doesn't need the effect to be relevant because he just wants me to amaze the audience and then say that ask if the Crowd is equally amazed with the person of Jesus Christ.

The flow sounds very illogical, and frankly speaking, I am not sure it is wise to insert a trick for this purpose.

What do you think? I think that if it is not relevant, the trick will stick out like a sore thumb if I suddenly walk on the stage, perform something totally irrevelant, and then walk off".

I'm not familiar with Greg Wilson's revelation in spades and I do not have much props with me at the moment. Still waiting for the rest if my luggage to arrive in Singapore (I just moved back from Australia).

I used to have a a full deck story stack about the story of Jesus Christ and his resurrection. (Perfect for Easter Sunday!) But I forgot who it's from.

Anyway, someone posted a video on an effect with the wand getting bigger the each time.

Forgot the name, but it is rather funny. You might want to avoid cards unless you have a big screen or something. An audience of 60-70 teens is huge.


*I found the clip, it's in here

http://forums.singaporemagiccircle.com/ind...?showtopic=8746

Actually I think I agree with your pastor on this one. I don't think the flow is illogical, and it looks to me that your pastor wants to talk about 'amazement' as a reaction to the divine.

In fact I think your pastor is wise to make the distinction and not attempt to use magic per se as a vehicle to convey the message. Rather I think he is trying to evoke the feeling of amazement from a jaded audience (teens), then ask them to reflect if the same feeling of amazement occurs daily as we contemplate our life.

Here's what I would do:

Trick: Dream of Aces
Needs: A table, 2 volunteers.
The table should be low, so that more people can see. The 2 volunteers are there as the eyes and ears of the crowd. Have them verify the deck, inspect props etc. Perform for them - their reactions will affect the rest of the crowd. In other words, your typical closeup parlor type situation.

Patter & Execution (adjust as necessary):
"Good morning everyone. My name is Joel and I am a magician. As a magician my job and my calling is to amaze people. As a Christian I believe when all is said and done, when our life is over, if we have fought the good fight we will meet God face to face. Our first reaction then can only be amazement."

"Magic attempts to emulate this."

(Take out deck)

"Consider this deck of cards. I am about to perform a simple illusion using this humble prop, however it will appear absolutely impossible. Watch closely. "

"First we require the 4 aces."

(Ace cutting sequence, or simply remove them from the deck. Display the deck to the volunteers.)

"Please also verify that there are no other aces present. Correct? Good."

"The 4 Aces are placed on the table, face-up. I will now place 3 indifferent cards onto each one, forming 4 piles."

(You know what to do from here. =) )

I don't think I need to go through the patter as from hereon it is highly dependent on method. You will however need to think up a good way of presenting the climax of the effect and tying it back to the theme of amazement. That one I leave to you.

Thanks for your attention, I hope this humble post helped - if not for the trick then for the ideas.

hey dude.

Ill be honest with you, keep the magic away from the Gospel cos if there is one reason I'm an atheist, its because I'm a magician.

Just my two cents. If you have any philosophical-minded youth in your audience you might push them down that path and I suppose thats not what you want =P

CSJ

I understand what you are saying, but do indulge me.

First off, you are an atheist simply because you don't believe in God. Magic has nothing to do with it. You made a choice. Don't use magic as a reason.

I could argue that being atheist is just as irrational as believing in any religion, but that is frankly outside the scope of the forum. If you want to seriously discuss it, pm me.

That being said, the way I see it, magic humbles me, and that allows me to exercise my faith. Here's why.

If something so childishly simple as a DL can fool the human mind/eye, it seems to imply that our human senses are rather fallible when it comes to examining the world around us. How do we know there is nothing else outside of our 5 senses? Is there anything else other than what we see, hear, touch, smell or taste?

If there were there would be no way to observe it. I simply choose to believe that there is something else out there, whilst you believe there isn't.

Magic teaches me that human perception is inherently imperfect. What we make of that conclusion is up to us.

Big Bad Wolf,

That big wand clip is really funny. Do you know where I can get those huge wands?

Mattlee,

Thanks for those ideas. It's not my pastor actually, but my friend who is speaking to the youth group on that day. I've gone through a couple of Duane Laflin's stuff earlier today, but can't find a single thing that does not use props. (and I do not really like the silk and sponge-ball that he teaches.)

Since it does not really have to be relevant, I might just have to do with tricks that use little props, like Frizz Master, Pk touches, Numberground (have this one with me) or something like that. Goodness. How do I perform on stage without magic props. Feel so handicap.

Tying in a relevant message is such a challenge.

csjoshi,

I do not see a clash with magic tricks and the Gospel. I often use magic tricks to break the ice in one-on-one encounters sharing the gospel.

I also doubt that magic tricks has anything to do with a person believing or not believing in Theism. And as far as philosophy go, having done quite a bit of philosophy in university, I actually see Christian philosophy having the upper hand in debates on theism/atheism/agnostism (e.g. Anthony Flew vs. William Lane Craig). Many of the leading philosophers are also Christian philosophers. (e.g. World class logician, Alvin Plantinga, Ravi Zacharias, Gordon Clark, etc) I've also used magic tricks in debates before to debunk atheistic ideology, so at least from that perspective alone, I would say that it is unfair to say that magic supports either Theism or Atheism.

Oh my! That biggest wand set cost USD$145. For foam wands! This is crazy.

joel: How about Sponge Balls to Sponge Cross as the finale? or Rose from a Deck? Cardiographic is nice too.

It's the faith and belief that matters. Magic shouldn't be a factor.

Btw...Christianity is not a religion, it's a relationship with God

Let us stick to the discussion of helping joel out here instead of discussing other matters like such. It is very sensitive.

Cheers.

No Props with me. All still in my boxes slowly shipping from Australia to Singapore.

I think it's really interesting incorporating magic into a religious context. I think what you've said before about drawing a balance is really important. One suggestion i can give that might help to prevent the medium from overshadowing your message would be to use music. How about playing a praise or worship song and perform the trick without the use of words? Personally i'd play "above all' (u can pm me if u don't know that song but i'm sure you do) while performing a floating rose routine. =)) It's quite apt cos of the lyrics "like a rose trampled on the ground". The symbolism of christ being like a rose and the actual rose in your routine can be quite powerful i think... =))

my 2c

Peace,
Bryan

I was just about to suggest PK touches as a 2nd choice. I assume its the one from Oz's lecture? When Oz performs it, it enters the miracle class. Good choice, but very presentation heavy.

You reminded me matt when you mentioned about Oz.

How about the 21st Century Phantom by Oz Pearlman?

You can use the Christ, the Man Himself as the climax. ^_^

Hmm... Both seem like good really options as well. I've the DVD for Phantom but not perform it yet. Have performed PK touches before. Both seem like really good options.

Thanks,

Joel Tay

Hmm... what is the subject your pastor is preaching? If you can't find a relevant effect for it, I suggest you just dop it.

My idea:

How about doing a miser's dream or any multiplying effect? The story of the 5 loaves and 2 fishes...

i suggest you use "science magic."

I remembered there was once a magician came to my church and did something like putting a black silk cloth into a glass of red water (Jesus blood I guess) and when he took it out, it was white. Maybe use this science incorporated magic as cards and PK don't go really well with a theme?

Not the pastor, but an leader in the youth service.

On science, I have one where blackened water is made clear by stirring with a big white plastic cross symbolising the removal of sin. But I don't have my props with me yet.

I've discussed this with him and he still likes the gas transfer one. I am thinking of bringing in this trick while teaching briefly on the doctrine of propitiation - where the sins of men were transfered upon Christ on the cross and his righteousness being transferred to the man - symbolised by the gas exchanging place in the cans. (of course minusing the big words for teaching to youth) Then tie this in with Rev 5:12-14 where this sacrifice on the cross is remembered as one of the main themes of worship for all eternity and how we are to be continually amazed by the cross and Christ Himself.

Finer details still to be established, but this effect is rather relevant to what he is teaching - worship and amazement with the person of Christ.

Thanks for the other ideas provided. (Mattlee, bigbadwolf, bmt, muscleaxl, M.A.D., Achmed and other) Will take note of them and may use them in future acts. Chances are, I definitely will. They are great ideas. :lol:

And Achmed, I thought you were muslim. Jeff Dunham. :!!: Joking.

Mattlee said:

More like its irrelevant. You shouldn't have to sensitive about polite disagreement.

Anyway, you might have to rework 21st Century Phanton alot cos Who're the other celebs you're going to use? Matthew, John, Mark, Luke? Cos you can't make it too obvious that the spectator is going to pick out "the man himself"

Mattlee, Joeltay etc i would like to discuss. Drop me a PM with your email and ill add you on MSN

CSJ

Hey, just my 2 cents worth.

I believe most religion, or beliefs are about building faith in one person and in turn, using a relation, in making person strong and confidence. So in that sense, how about doing something about faith and strength.

Believing in themselves and miracles will happen.

I recall watching the Taiwan show about magic that the theme is hitching in a pub, and one of the guy did a card effect. The link is below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hauAiYLcdns&feature=related

Even though I find the presentation abit weak, but I believe in using proper script, it bring it to a different level.

Another kind of thing I will do is mental effects. I can do a blindfold effect with a presentation that says about me believing in myself, and that I can do marvalous stuffs that is not easily mastered by the others.

I feel is that for a 60-70 crowd, you have to use more visual than outcome, as in some card effects are best of with small groups, but in bigger group you need HUGH items. :)

Hey, Stay white. Jeff Dunham. Joking man.

Silence! I kill you. *EVIL LAUGH*

Rope is always good i think ^_^

Cut and Restored, or simple rope with modified patter, 3 unequal rope, 3 equal, 1 rope, well, in Christian those numbers are common right :rolleyes:

And you can get rope easily i believe ^_^

csjoshi,

Good point on 21st Century Phantom.

Hi Joel!

I know this might sound a bit late but there material out there that can help in your future performances on Gospel Magic.

First, if know this guy by the name of Duane Laflin, he has a huge range of stuff and presentational ideas pertaining to this subject. One book that you can try to locate with all those ideas is "Greater Gospel Magic" by him. Its out of print though. You might one to hunt for it. IMO, it is a phenomenal work about the subject.

Other than that, if the intent of the performance is just to incite amazement, just about anything you perform on a regular basis will do. Who bothers much about reenacting the miracles of X in that case?

Kenneth

P.S. As for my stand in Gospel Magic, I personally find it more of an act of goodwill than of any actual use. Since there is a fine line between the entertainment as the primary focus, or the message is the primary focus. IMO, it is very hard to strike a balance as far as these are concerned. People might just be wondering what will happen to the cards/coins/ropes/doves/cats/dogs/reptile/whatever next rather than listening to your message. (Added note that Vernon mentioned that in one of his articles in Genii Magazine long time ago.)

Added to that, the cultural setting also plays a big part on whether gospel magic should be performed. Discretion is much needed if the group of people you are performing to are superstitious, as a wrong message might be communicated if not handled properly.

Even though I do see the use of Gospel magic in spreading the Gospel of X, I would exclusively reserve magic as a form of entertainment than actually bringing forth a message using such methods.

Above all that, one form of magic one might consider are pseudo-psychic/black magic effects. I particularly find this form of performance more interesting as they are there to debunk New Age/psychic/esoteric phenomena which people normally believe which are of a spritual cause. Andre Kole, a famous illusionist, does such performances much often. By re-enacting phenomena that is present in seance sitting and such, he successfully debunks the spiritual causes of such things. This might be field of magic that will bring greater understanding and awareness to people that all these are just artificial and nothing to do with the so-called "The spirits caused the table to move".

Think about this. If you re-enact the miracles of X, you are merely showing that anyone can do what He did, thereby negating His Deity, isn't it? Well, I know that X didn't need a 5 tonner full of props to do His miracles, but the underlying notion is there eh?

PMs, opinions, feedback, violent objections and legal actions welcome. Just my 2 cents.

I actually have greater gospel magic. the book itself talks about how to be a gospel magician like getting contacts, setting the environment etc. He also gave some routine, however, you will be required to get the props yourself, and most of the routine required you to get it. It is not a great book but it does give some routine ideas for sharing the Word.

Adrian